Build 94 Sonoma build

Bebop said:
The TCU is inside the 6L80. And the Holley doesn't replace that, yeah.
But it would let you put a 6L80 behind a 302 Ford for exemple.
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Of course. But part of this thread has been talking about actually tuning the transmission shift points, etc. So I just wanted to put it out there, that even with the Holley 6L80 controller, you would still need another method (HP tuners) in order to actually tune the transmission. It doesn't fit the bill of being able to both connect the TCU to the ECU and tune the transmission.
 
Bebop said:
Well yeah, that's the point.


The TCU is inside the 6L80. And the Holley doesn't replace that, yeah.
But it would let you put a 6L80 behind a 302 Ford for exemple.
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I agree, just not sure if it makes sense for op to put a holley terminator x on a tbi 4.3 :laughing:

Although I guess it would make a V8 swap down the road easy
 
I know enough to get in trouble with using HP Tuners which for me is more of a tool for engine swaps, deleting DTC flags, etc. then actual tuning fuel and ignition tables.

Anyone have experience actually adjusting TCM shift pressures, points, etc. on the 6L80 from I would reference myself as a public educated mekanik?

I fully tuned a 4L80 my CUCV but that is through the stand alone controller GUI which is a set up wizard and then small adjustments in the tables which to me was very simple. It's also a pretty dumb single step trans with an on or off lockup so there is that...

Just curious since it does have some very nice ratios to work with.
 
broken4_racing said:
I run a terminator X with the 6L80 controller on my Ultra4 car. While their controller does connect the TCM to the terminator, it doesnt allow for adjustments. It more just provides the link. In the Holley software you cant change any of the shift points, pressures, etc. All of that still needs to be adjusted using HP tuners.

Its still a good option to have 6L80 control with a pretty universal ECU, but it does have some limitations I think people should be aware of.
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YotaAtieToo said:
I agree, just not sure if it makes sense for op to put a holley terminator x on a tbi 4.3 :laughing:

Although I guess it would make a V8 swap down the road easy
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But wont that give me 150hp more according instagram :lmao:
Skinny said:
I know enough to get in trouble with using HP Tuners which for me is more of a tool for engine swaps, deleting DTC flags, etc. then actual tuning fuel and ignition tables.

Anyone have experience actually adjusting TCM shift pressures, points, etc. on the 6L80 from I would reference myself as a public educated mekanik?

I fully tuned a 4L80 my CUCV but that is through the stand alone controller GUI which is a set up wizard and then small adjustments in the tables which to me was very simple. It's also a pretty dumb single step trans with an on or off lockup so there is that...

Just curious since it does have some very nice ratios to work with.
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I would probably get myself in trouble also. Once I get the suspension done then I will have to tackle the transmission issue.

What a hot mess the Balljoints were on the knuckles. Turns out the Maddox press from the HF does not work on the superduty axles. Even the adapter kit still has issues. I had to cut some 1.75x.120 tubing to make a adapter otherwise I couldnt find a collar to work on the top one. I made the mistake of installing the lower one first but had to remove it for the thread.
Top BJ adapter.jpg


Adapter kit had both collars I believe.
Bottom BJ.jpg


Managed to get Discount tire to mount the tires onto 2 of the steel rims for free but I tip them 30 dollars. The guy got it knocked out in 15 minutes. Spaced the tire 1.5in off the mounting face by using some extra lug nuts I had. The studs are 2inches long from the mounting face to the end. Either wheel spacers will be needed or new rims to increase the backspacing.
40in fit 1.jpg


Might need some trimming on the backwheel well area or move axle forward a little more.
40in fit 1-2.jpg
 
I'm surprised with that size tire you aren't pushing further forward. I don't like the look of the axle way far out but it solves a lot of problems.

I would slap a pitman on the box and mockup where your drag link is going to land. If you are keeping the box where it is and using a forward facing Waggy arm I'm curious how far back the draglink angle is.
 
Skinny said:
I'm surprised with that size tire you aren't pushing further forward. I don't like the look of the axle way far out but it solves a lot of problems.

I would slap a pitman on the box and mockup where your drag link is going to land. If you are keeping the box where it is and using a forward facing Waggy arm I'm curious how far back the draglink angle is.
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I will be pushing it forward a little bit more to avoid cutting into the cab area. Part of the reason why I picked up tires already.
 
Yeah S10 wheel arch not easy to work with.You can nip the front off and go pretty far forward but you quickly go into fugly mode.

Definitely a cool stage of the build!
 
Skinny said:
Yeah S10 wheel arch not easy to work with.You can nip the front off and go pretty far forward but you quickly go into fugly mode.

Definitely a cool stage of the build!
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Not looking forward to figuring out how to make it look good after trimming.


There was no wind this morning so knocked out painting the rear axle outside.
Light rust.jpg


self etching primer
self etching primer.jpg


Could be a little darker but will do for now.
Rear axle gray paint.jpg


Tires hit the links with a 3/16-1/4 of distance before hitting the knuckle hard stops. Moving the link frame mounts in a few inches will allow for full travel.
1-1.5 clearance.jpg


Links will now be 36in eye to eye to allow for the change in angle and push the axle forward 2 inches. I used 1.75x.120 tubing for a temperary setup to avoid wasting expensive tube. Also placed a sleeve tube inside so I could lengthen the tube if needed.
Increasing length.jpg


I should also straighten the temp brace across now that I have a new transmission mount and I need to bring the mounts in more. I will be building a much more stout version once everything is set.
Crooked as **** brace.jpg
 
Nice

I know you are going to run a 1350 front CV right? That space where it sits on the output flange gets occupied with a lot of other **** like your link mount and guessing a crossmember as well.

Probably wouldn't hurt to try and get that up in there just to make sure you don't burn everything in and then find out it hits the front shaft.

I remember packaging all of that wasn't as easy as I thought and my spring hanger doesn't sit as far inboard as your link mount.
 
Skinny said:
Nice

I know you are going to run a 1350 front CV right? That space where it sits on the output flange gets occupied with a lot of other **** like your link mount and guessing a crossmember as well.

Probably wouldn't hurt to try and get that up in there just to make sure you don't burn everything in and then find out it hits the front shaft.

I remember packaging all of that wasn't as easy as I thought and my spring hanger doesn't sit as far inboard as your link mount.
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Yes I will probably be running a 1350 cv for front and rear.

Fitting everything has been alot of fun and challenging. Some of my mounts look interesting but it more of a temp thing for testing.

Axle panhard mount really sucks for placement once the tie rod is on the axle. Any little bit of movement causes the tie rod to hit the mount when a non-bent tie rod.
Tie rod issue.jpg


I lifted the mount up on the axle to provide clearance to the tie rod. I will need to move the upper link back a little to avoid interference.
Tie rod temp.jpg


One of my awesome temp brackets. Should be a leaf spring bracket but works for testing out fit.
Tie rod temp 2.jpg


Tight fit but this is at full up travel. The nut to the steering box is right next to the diff cover also.
Tie rod temp fit.jpg



And yes the arms are still fighting me. I would really recommend having a temp joints when welding them up. This one should be easy to fix with my pencil sander. Barely misaligned but still stopping the 5/8 bolt from going in with a 7/8 heim. The arms fit a 3/4 heim just fine but rather go bigger.
Tie-rod arm issue.jpg


Hitting the back wall slightly. I will be sanding a relieve into the back wall to allow heim to fit.
Tie-rod arm issue 2.jpg
 
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Damn she tight! That D60 center section doesn't look that big till you try to stuff it up under there.

I realized while building mine that I can't do hi steer while being at my ride height. Hence my kill a bus full of nuns bent draglink.

Also remember I took like 7 or 8 inches out of my axle so my center section sits further inboard then yours.

Amazing how **** fills all the same spaces so quickly!
 
Skinny said:
Damn she tight! That D60 center section doesn't look that big till you try to stuff it up under there.

I realized while building mine that I can't do hi steer while being at my ride height. Hence my kill a bus full of nuns bent draglink.

Also remember I took like 7 or 8 inches out of my axle so my center section sits further inboard then yours.

Amazing how **** fills all the same spaces so quickly!
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This would be easier if I didnt care about ride height but no desire for super tall truck.

Slow day while waiting on parts that were suppose to be here yesterday but dont arrive till tomorrow. Knocked out modifying the bolts from Mcmaster to replace the rear axle flange bolts. Everywhere wanted $8-10/bolt while Mcmaster was $1.23/bolt.
Mcmaster P/N 98093A761
Flanged, M12 x 1.75 mm Thread Size, 40 mm Long

Flange will stop tire from going on easy since it extends past the axle flange.
Rear axle bolts.jpg


Mcmaster bolt turned down to .800in to match the flange diameter of the original bolt. Old head used a 15mm socket while new uses 18mm.
Rear axle bolts 3.jpg
Rear axle bolts 2.jpg
 
Amazon wheel spacers finally arrived so I could better mimic what a 3.5" backspace wheel will be.

Hmmm, doesnt seem to fit on the superduty hub. I dont know if the hubs are factory or aftermarket at this point.
amazon crap gap.jpg


Fitting isnt a option!
Amazon crap.jpg


Had to increase the inner diameter by about .200in and .385 deep.
amazon crap relieved.jpg


That will work donkey. Also used half of the securing nuts to set the correct spacing a 3.5 backspace rim will have to ~2.4in since nobody sells a wheel spacer like that. Shocking I know.
Amazon crap setup.jpg


Not to much trimming to do on the truck. This is at full compression.
Full compression.jpg


Very tight but I will clearance this about 1/2 to 1in since I dont want to push axle forward anymore. Also this is a used tire so new one will have even less clearance.
Tire clearance.jpg



At full lock I barely graze the lower link still so I will be moving the lower axle link mounts in a few inches similar to '84 Bronco II mount by the pumpkin. I dont have a picture of it right now.
 
Accomplished some rough trimming on the driver side wheel well. Tomorrow I will knock out the passenger side

Not sure how I feel about the lines yet.
rough trim 1.jpg


rough trim 2.jpg



rough trim 3.jpg


Used the plasma to remove small chucks at a time till the tire cleared the metal. Plan on using bedliner coating on the wheel wells to cover the missing paint from the plasma and future welding. Chunk that I removed but will need to be batched.
rough trim 4.jpg



Also rebuilt the Sterling axle hubs with new bearing races and bearings. Learned a important lesson about the hub seals, dont install the hub till your done done. The hub seal falls apart when you try to pull the hub back off the spindle. $20 down the drain. Now I have the hubs taped shut till Im ready to install.

Also need to clean the garage up again.
 
I kinda breezed through this, did you get your t-case figured out? We are going in the way back machine though years ago I used a weld it your self 231 doubler that used a cut up 231 t-case to convert an s10 5 bolt trans to 6 bolt 23 spline jeep. I think I used a 5 bolt S10 231 for the doubler and mounted a jeep 231 with SYE to it. I can't for the life of me remember who on the old board sold the 231 doubler kits. Also if you are just trying to get a fixed yoke rear drive shaft you can mix and match an s10 and a jeep 231 to use a jeep SYE with the Chevy case. I'm wondering if the 231 doubler kit would work on a 233 giving you an electronic shifter for the doubler.

This isn't the kit I used though is the same concept. NP231 Doubler Adapter-FS-NP-231 Under $1k for a doubler and SYE with 2 used 231's.
 
Jbconversions sells a sye that fits s10 233 or 231. I used the super short slip yoke eliminator on my 233.

And if you just want to get away from the shift motor, you can make a lever. There is or was a company with a kit for Astro vans.

But for this truck, I don’t think a 233 is very ideal. You can’t actually put it in neutral, like you could with a 231.

Link for ideas:

www.journeysoffroad.com

NP233 Manual Shift Conversion Kit

By request we made this kit available for people who were converting their early Jeeps, Scouts, and other vintage 4x4's to the S-10 4.3 / 4L60 / NP233 drivetrain. It has also been used to convert 3 button electric S10 Pickups to Manual Shift.
www.journeysoffroad.com

That said something about a waterproof switch for 4L. If I remember right the doubler guys were grounding a black wire under the center console, but I never dug into it to find out myself.
 
barrelroll said:
I kinda breezed through this, did you get your t-case figured out? We are going in the way back machine though years ago I used a weld it your self 231 doubler that used a cut up 231 t-case to convert an s10 5 bolt trans to 6 bolt 23 spline jeep. I think I used a 5 bolt S10 231 for the doubler and mounted a jeep 231 with SYE to it. I can't for the life of me remember who on the old board sold the 231 doubler kits. Also if you are just trying to get a fixed yoke rear drive shaft you can mix and match an s10 and a jeep 231 to use a jeep SYE with the Chevy case. I'm wondering if the 231 doubler kit would work on a 233 giving you an electronic shifter for the doubler.

This isn't the kit I used though is the same concept. NP231 Doubler Adapter-FS-NP-231 Under $1k for a doubler and SYE with 2 used 231's.
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Decided to just buy the kit to solve the transmission and front driveshaft angle problem. No reason to keep going around in circle about what year of 4l60e to purchase and if I would need a updated computer for it. Hopefully its not a 3 month wait for the thing but we shall see. Adds some new difficulty with driveshaft location compared to frame links but at least I know the general placement of the output.

Fingers crossed that it arrives in a decent time.
 
Duc said:
Decided to just buy the kit to solve the transmission and front driveshaft angle problem. No reason to keep going around in circle about what year of 4l60e to purchase and if I would need a updated computer for it. Hopefully its not a 3 month wait for the thing but we shall see. Adds some new difficulty with driveshaft location compared to frame links but at least I know the general placement of the output.

Fingers crossed that it arrives in a decent time.
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The doubler is awesome for wheeling as well. 4 low for simple trails, low low for dumb things.
 
barrelroll said:
The doubler is awesome for wheeling as well. 4 low for simple trails, low low for dumb things.
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I've had one before in a 2000 tacoma with a 14bolt front and rear plus a inchworm doubler. I wont miss feathering the clutch during certain climbs even with the doubler.


Took some ideas from Ghetto Fab. build on suggestions by '84 Bronco II to pull the axle links further in. Mine will not look this good.
Ghetto Fabs 2.jpg


I still need to add additional bracing to the mount once the links are finalized.
Driver link .jpg


Tomorrow I will remount the tires to check for clearance again. Also need to recenter the axle by adjusting the panhard bar.
Lower link adjustment.jpg


New Numbers
1759460872538.png
 
Ran to the junkyard today to find some driveshaft and misc stuff. Luck was on my side for this run when I found a NP241 in the back of a truck and the shifter was easy to remove from inside the cab. Pot of gold was the 2006 F250 4WD Superduty that nobody had removed parts from yet. Quick text to '84 Bronco II with a picture of the front axle. By some miracle I ran into 2 coworkers already at the junkyard to help with removal of the axle while I waited for 84 Bronco to show up with the proper tools. Hell even the hoist was 4 cars down which is very rare. Turns out truck had just been placed that morning.
Work party.jpg


I left with the NP241, manual shifter and the driveshafts for the Superduty for $240 I think.
Junkyard run.jpg
 
Also time to buy a HF wagon for junkyard runs. The wheel borrows suck even when you can find one.
 
Thanks for the heads up, that was the perfect find, especially since someone had already cut the rivets out of the coil buckets.
 
Duc said:
Turns out truck had just been placed that morning.
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Was this a PnP yard? If so, which yard? I want to check Row52, I’ve been curious of timing on actual placement in the yard and when they post on Row52.
 
Does anyone have the dimensions or dxf of the bolt holes to a NP233 case half and dimensions for the the GM 6 bolt Transfer case pattern?

Not really sure how long of a wait I have for the doubler kit so I was thinking about machining the plate. If I can make the plate then I can at least continue the setup of the links and driveshafts.
 
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