91 Camaro

In an effort to keep me motivated and keep track of my progress/thoughts I'm starting this thread.

I've been a 3rd gen guy for as long as I can remember. My mom had an 88 Formula she bought new, her winter car was an 85 Camaro. Formula was supposed to be my first car before she got rear-ended and totaled it. Eventually I ended up with the 85 which at that point was quite the pile. Since then, I've owned probably over 50 of them in various flavors. Z28's, Formula's, TransAm's and Rs's along with a few 4th gen cars (Ws6/SS varieties) thrown in.

Currently own a 91 Firebird convertible that I bought from a friend of mine. He owned the local hardware store and bought it new. That car was his baby, put in a garage door on the side of his store and built a room to keep it in. He claimed it had never seen rain the entire time he owned it. Always told him if he ever wanted to sell it I want first chance at it. Shortly before he passed he dropped it off and told me his price. Admittedly it was probably a little high, but I knew the history over it and save for a little wear on the top, it looked like it just rolled off the showroom floor. Car has 53,xxx miles on it and is a creampuff. Only gets driven on nice days with the top down. If there is any flaw with it is that it is a v6 car. While slow by today's standards, at the time it was probably more than adequate. It'll cruise down the road at 80 no problem...it just takes its time getting there. That's where this car comes in. The Firebird is just too nice to tear into. It just floats down the road and runs absolutely perfect. While not a high value car, I can appreciate it for what it is and don't want to ruin that.

With all of that said, what have I got for this build? A 1991 Rs Camaro that's been Ls swapped with a 6 speed. I had seen it on marketplace and messaged back and forth with the guy a little bit. The passenger side had been side swiped and the paint was gone. Rest of the body looked to be in decent shape. Threw him a low ball offer and he took it.

Only picture I have from when I got it in 2023.




It had been wrecked once before and repaired, guessing that's when the cowl hood went on. Has a clean ***le so I'm not that concerned.

Seller claimed it has an LS1 block from an 04 GTO, 243 heads/cam/intake from a Z06 Corvette. Magnum F T56 and 4th gen width rear axle with 3.73's, torsen diff and aftermarket axles. Haven't confirmed displacement or cam, but it does have an aluminum block/243 heads/Ls6 intake, 4th gen rear with what he said. Also got the receipt for the trans from Tick. So I'll take his word for it. Car also has MagnaFlow cat back, aftermarket rear lower control arms, relocation brackets, tubular front crossmember, tunnel mounted torque arm, adjustable torque arm, adjustable panhard bar and lowering springs. I'm into it for $2800. Initial thought was I could part it out and make my money back fairly easy if I didn't keep it.

After getting the car home and on the lift, came to the conclusion that whoever did the LS swap is not who originally put everything else on the car. The install is total garbage. Computer and harness laying on the passenger floor, wires just twisted together. They cut the bottom of hood structure to clear the alternator on the Ls truck brackets.

Despite the shiny install, the motor runs fantastic and has 40psi of oil pressure at idle on the mechanical gauge. Has a cracked oil pan and leaky rear seal. Will get cleaned up and probably a cam before going back in.


How it currently sits.








Plan is to strip it down completely (in process of now), bodywork/repaint, clean install of the engine and interior. Along the way it'll get some subframe connectors and most likely end up a different color both interior and exterior.

What prompted me to get going on this (car has been sitting since early 2024 after I drove it for a few weeks after buying it) was me finding another one. Again I was scrolling through marketplace and came across another 91. Guy had just listed it a few hours before I saw it. Messaged him and he claimed it was in pretty good shape with only needing a little floor work. Tossed out a low ball offer and he took it. Once getting there I got the feeling he needed the money quick.

After looking at it, his idea of "a little floor work" was different than mine. Both front footwells were gone and the spare tire well was missing the bottom. Rear quarters were starting to go as well. Knowing this and knowing what mine needed, I gave an even lower offer, kind of a **** move on my part after we already agreed on a price, told him it was worse than he let on and on top of that he couldn't find the ***le. Into this one for $200.




It's just a coincidence that it's the same year/color/cowl hood as the other one. I believe they have both been repainted at one point but it's interesting to see the "same color" next to itself and be so different.





What I need from the donor is some of the ground effects mainly. I did get the nose as well and it might be in better shape than mine. Even though I've got another door (on the saw horse) I'll probably use the one from this. There are a few other things I can use so I'm not mad about the purchase.

Pic of under the hood. This is after I ripped out a bunch of wiring. I didn't do much with the engine harness, which looks to just be a generic swap one.

I haven't run the VIN or the RPO codes, but I'm assuming this started out as a v6/auto car. Has v6 radiator/fan. I know it was an auto car because the shift interlock cable was still under the carpet when I pulled it. Note the zip-loc master cylinder cap.

Someone installed the non-ac heater box at some point. Those yellow butt connectors run into a toggle switch to turn the fan on high.




Surprisingly the rocker didn't take any real hit, just the fender/door/quarter. I snagged a piece of the quarter/door jamb from another car I parted.




Once I get the running gear out I'll strip the rest of the chassis down. Probably stick it on the trailer to run it into work and hit it with the Hotsy to get all the grime off before doing any real work.

Front end and doors off, fluids drained and engine harness pulled. If it's not too humid tomorrow I'll try getting the motor and transmission pulled.

In for the ride.

Only managed to get the driveshaft and transmission pulled today.

Jury is still out if it's an actual Magnum F transmission. It's slightly different than the other T56 I've got under the bench.

It shifted fairly decent. It had clutch problems though, either air in the system or wrong combination of master/slave. 3rd gen masters usually don't moven enough fluid to release the clutch all the way. When I pulled the line off the slave there wasn't any fluid there at all. I may open this up just to give it a once over while it's out.




Putting these here so I don't loose the numbers. My other T56 has a Borg Warner logo where this one has the Tremic.

To lift the motor out I'd have to drop the car down from the jack stands to roll it backwards. I prefer to use a chain fall from the ceiling instead of the cherry picker. Decided to continue to strip out the interior.

Dash out and majority of wiring out.




Scored with a set of 4th gen pedals. I'd assumed they were factory 3rd gen that got swapped in. Never really noticed the "ABS" on the brake pedal. Will make reassembly easier when I get new clutch hydraulics.




Didn't mention it in the first post, but it's got a 145mph cluster as well. Would have been a Z28 only item. With the 5500rpm redline it would have come from a 305/5speed or 350/auto car.

In for the build. Seems like good deals for what you got, they aren't around in good shape & cheap often.

I didn't have nearly as many as you but I have had 6 of the 3rd gens if you count both the Camaro and Firebird\Trans AM. Of course the one that got away value wise was a Teal 1991 5spd Iroc that I sold to a friend just for him to wreck it a week later and total it. The one I think I miss the most was a 1987 Trans AM just because I dropped a 383 in it and it was white with checkered flag graphics going back from front wheelwell until the back of the car was black. I'd have to find my old polaroid pic of it and scan it or snap a cell pic of it lol. 1992 anniversary V6 5spd was a fun driver but probably not very interesting to anyone other than me lol.

Following, keep up the posting, I like it.

I have never been a fan of these cars but seeing what you can do with it will be interesting to watch

Out!




Confirmed it's atleast an Ls1. Didn't look for any block casting numbers. I'm not that concerned with it.




Before pulling the motor and setting it back on the ground I removed the rest of the interior stuff. Few small pieces left but for the most part it's bare.




Will start taking off the fuel/brake lines and suspension stuff next time I'm out there.

Can see the previous crash damage in the frame rails and the crease on the driver's side wheel house. I'll probably clean up the damaged areas some. I'm not going to front half the car as none of it looks like it's structural. All the damage is in front of the crossmember mounting points. The car drove fine and didn't look like it was tweaked...all the sheet metal fit well. I didn't find where they had to open up any holes or shim anything real crazy.

350TacoZilla said:

In for the build. Seems like good deals for what you got, they aren't around in good shape & cheap often.

I didn't have nearly as many as you but I have had 6 of the 3rd gens if you count both the Camaro and Firebird\Trans AM. Of course the one that got away value wise was a Teal 1991 5spd Iroc that I sold to a friend just for him to wreck it a week later and total it. The one I think I miss the most was a 1987 Trans AM just because I dropped a 383 in it and it was white with checkered flag graphics going back from front wheelwell until the back of the car was black. I'd have to find my old polaroid pic of it and scan it or snap a cell pic of it lol. 1992 anniversary V6 5spd was a fun driver but probably not very interesting to anyone other than me lol.

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Fairly confident I could part out and make money at this point with the prices I've gotten stuff for.

There are still alot of clean ones out there. These cars aren't rare (save for FireHawks or 1LE cars), but values are going up....it's just their time in the market now. I couldn't bring myself to spend good money on another low mile "survivor" car and then tear it all apart and do what I want with it. I'm into this cheap enough and I actually enjoy the project aspect of it.

The one I miss the most was my 91 Formula. Bought it as a roller and stuck a healthy TPI 350/T5/3.73's in it. Didn't need to sell it, got tired of paying the $70/month for the storage unit so I decided to let it go as it didn't get driven often once it got moved there. I don't regret selling it....but in should have kept it.

crispins said:

Following, keep up the posting, I like it.

I have never been a fan of these cars but seeing what you can do with it will be interesting to watch.

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For the most part it's going to be a pretty standard build as far as these cars go. Intend to have it driving for next summer hopefully.

love it and now wishing I had one to work on as it looks so simple

does this chassis allow a turbo and a/c without crazy work?

That is what I want next, turbo ls, 6 speed, cold a/c

crispins said:

does this chassis allow a turbo and a/c without crazy work?

That is what I want next, turbo ls, 6 speed, cold a/c

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Turbo is fairly easy to do. Adding AC into it gets a little tight, but still doable. The factory AC box takes up a lot of room and makes running the downpipe through there tough. Switching to an under dash unit like VintageAir opens up quite a bit of room. If you're ok with fender exits then anything is possible.

Running the AC compressor in the factory location, down low on the passenger side, you have to notch the crossmember some. Pretty straight forward, there are even kits out there that come with the formed notch piece you weld in after cutting the crossmember.

I do have a 'budget' for this so AC won't happen right away. I do have VintageAir in two of my other projects and will probably go that route when I eventually add it.

I really thought hard about a turbo build for this car, but decided against it and will just do a simple cam/headers. When I get around to my 03 RCSB Sierra I'll do a turbo build.

toomany said:

I don't regret selling it....but in should have kept it.

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Man do I hear that.....

Quick derail (hopefully), Rusty Wallace, MGD or sentimental value on the T-bird?

I'll be following along too.

Mud Rod said:

Quick derail (hopefully), Rusty Wallace, MGD or sentimental value on the T-bird?

I'll be following along too.

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My dad got that for me when I was probably 8 or so and big into NASCAR. He was in the bar when the distributor rep came in and he asked if there was anything in the van he could have.

Terry Labonte was my guy or really any of the other Hendrick cars at the time. We had season tickets to MIS and went for 20ish years. I've got autographs from quite a few drivers. Got to sit in Johnny Benson's car when he came to the local Pontiac dealer. Met Kyle and Adam Petty when our local track had ASA show up. I stopped following a few years after Earnhardt died and they implemented "The Chase". Despite not following anymore, we are going to try getting down to Bristol for the night race next year I think.

To further derail, I spent 19 years working in a bar. Collected a lot of beer mirrors and random beer NASCAR/sports stuff.

In,

I shouldn’t have clicked on this, it’s making me want to change mine to an LS

In, Bitchin Camaro

Following for the nostalgia... Even though I'm the enemy (Mustang guy). I worked at our local Chevy dealership from 1995-2001 when I was in high school and college. I have driven thousands of these. Two stick out in my mind. The parts guy had an absolute mint, teal Formula that like your convertible, never saw anything but sunshine and was babied. Other was a local guy who had the baddest 95 ZR1 I ever saw. His DD was a red 3rd gen Iroc 5 spd that he had the factory wheels chrome dipped. I always thought it was a gorgeous car.

Awesome

I had originally planned on stripping every off the car and then hauling it in to wash it. Decided it would be much easier on myself to leave it as a roller to make getting it on/off the trailer less hassle.

Had to drop the axle way down to get the rest of the exhaust and gas tank out.




I'm all for a fuel pump trap door, but this is not the way to do it. I'm assuming the parts car has a good hump in it still, will use that to fix this and do a better access panel.

Forgot about the TA aluminum diff cover with load bolts. I was in the axle once already, mainly to see what gears it had and check the condition of everything. I remember pulling an axle shaft to replace some stripped wheel studs. Don't know what brand the axles are, but they've got screw in studs. In the above picture can see the 4th gen rear disc's. They are 98+/LS1 style. Fairly decent upgrade from the late 3rd gen PBR/LT1 parts.




Tunnel mounted torque arm. Again, great in theory but they screwed up in applying it. The crossmember is welded to the floor at the ends so not removable. They installed the bottom shackle bolt from the driver's side before welding it on. Can't get the bolt out now. As it is, I had to swing the torque arm all the way down to get the top bolt out (also installed from the driver's side). Once I get my sub frame connectors in, I'll make it so the crossmember bolts to those and is able to come out.




Hatch off, headliner and seat belts out.




In the morning I'm going to try taking off a few more things before loading it up and hauling it to work to power wash.


Edited for spelling.

Sprayed off the best it's going to get. Interior came out better than I was expecting. Only holes in the floor is right at the bottom of the A-pillar and a tiny one under the gas pedal. Big hole and surface rust on the rockers will get taken care of with the SFC's.

The floor is starting to tear where they welded the crossmember in. Not a huge deal to fix that.

I hate to ask the obvious but with all these small issues adding up how good of shape is the parts car shell?

350TacoZilla said:

I hate to ask the obvious but with all these small issues adding up how good of shape is the parts car shell?

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I'll get some pictures tomorrow, but it's worse than what I'm working with on this one.

No problem I just figured maybe it was one of those take a step back and think moments lol. I have had that where the parts vehicle ends up just being the better choice.

I had an 86 Iroc in college that I did alot of work to, was a salvage ***le POS but it was a fun car at the time. I wish I still had it. I'll be watching this thread!

This thread reminds me how simple **** used to be.

Right? SBC with a carb and 300hp made these cars into a fun playtoy. If I'm generous and say my 383 was 400hp that thing ripped with TH350 and 3.73's.

I seriously wanted to have my rx7 with a stock 4.8LS and 5spd in as a weekend run around car that had the v8 sound but was completely drivable if you wanted to just go cruise for awhile, AC on etc.