Ford doubler/underdrive tech

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    Ford doubler/underdrive tech

    So after my first trip with my Ranger I'm looking harder at doublers. Current setup is 4.0/np435/205, D60/14 bolt with 4.10s and 38s. I definitely need more gear and would rather not gear the axles.

    ​​​​I'm capable of re-gearing but would like to avoid it, if you've seen my build thread I'm using a 32 spline Dodge 60, I don't want to buy gears for the low pinion axle because if I break basically anything on it I'm buying a SD 60 and the gears wouldn't swap.

    On to my question, what's everyone doing for 31 spline input doublers?

    203/205. If I can source a Ford 203 the doublers are reasonably priced, I would prefer to have 3 speeds though so that's not my first choice. Also Ford 203s aren't falling out of every truck heading to the junkyard anymore.

    Behemoth, well they are Behemoth. If it was made by a reputable company an underdrive utilizing Borg Warner planets would absolutely be my first choice. Is there anybody else building these that I just haven't been able to find?

    NWF eco box. NWF has a great rep, I'm not big on extra machining due to using NP planets, anyone know what the machining entails and approximate cost to do so? NP planets aren't nearly as common as the Borg Warner stuff in my searching, plus the extra machining, makes it hard to put this as my first choice. The Titan just has a far higher price tag than I'm looking for with this build.

    As far as I know DD/Duffy is out of business, Jed's website hasn't been maintained so not sure if they are in business either. Are there any options my Google-fu hasn't turned up that are Ford friendly?
    Last edited by Hyde; 06-15-2020, 10:58 AM. Reason: I'm a smartphone using typo machine

    #2
    I have a doubler in my build right now, but mainly because I got the 203/205 already doubled together for really cheap. If it were me I would have went with the titan or Eco-box. NWFs new Eco-titan looks pretty good, although with the extra machining I'm not sure its worth saving the $700 and not just getting a complete ready to run unit.

    I most definitely would not order from Behemoth. They are the modern day Ballistic Fab, If you like spending money and not getting what you bought Behemoth is your place.
    Last edited by Toreadorranger; 06-15-2020, 11:20 AM.
    88 Ford F-turd50 IDI Crawler

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      #3
      If you're sticking with the anemic 4.0 I would get an Eco-Box and not look back. The NP271 F is super common and has the correct 31 spline input, and I think you can use the planetary setup from it... I could be wrong on that though, but later model GM 241s are dirt cheap and those planetaries should be the same cut as the 271, so it should work together. NP/NV tcases are generally fairly interchangeable between years, assuming you don't mix the 94 and earlier gear cut up with the 95 and later. The 31 spline input is also readily available on the internet from retailers for around $100.

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        #4
        Originally posted by Hyde View Post

        As far as I know DD/Duffy is out of business, Jed's website hasn't been maintained so not sure if they are in business either. Are there any options my Google-fu hasn't turned up that are Ford friendly?
        I just bought a jeds doubler kit. they are still in business

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          #5
          Originally posted by Scott Cee aka 2drx4 View Post
          If you're sticking with the anemic 4.0 I would get an Eco-Box and not look back. The NP271 F is super common and has the correct 31 spline input, and I think you can use the planetary setup from it... I could be wrong on that though, but later model GM 241s are dirt cheap and those planetaries should be the same cut as the 271, so it should work together. NP/NV tcases are generally fairly interchangeable between years, assuming you don't mix the 94 and earlier gear cut up with the 95 and later. The 31 spline input is also readily available on the internet from retailers for around $100.
          I have a mustang 5.0 on the shelf for when the 4.0 gives up, not that they are huge power or anything.

          Anyone done the eco box that knows exactly what machining you have have to do for the 31 spline input?

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            #6
            Originally posted by Hyde View Post

            I have a mustang 5.0 on the shelf for when the 4.0 gives up, not that they are huge power or anything.

            Anyone done the eco box that knows exactly what machining you have have to do for the 31 spline input?
            The 5.0 is still well within the power that the Eco-Box will take.

            Have you asked NWF? I know that's a weird solution, but they do actually know a lot about their product and are pretty willing to talk on the phone.

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              #7
              I haven't talked to NWF, that would be a decent place to start. I try not to tire kick and waste a companys time unless I have the cash ready to buy but I'm sure they could tell me

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                #8
                Ord may not make the ford/dodge bolt pattern clocking but they have a fully contained box.

                Prob not the easiest or cost efective but ford 203 seem to be common around hear right now. But honestly by the time i get you one ship it and the adapter cit your into the ord/nwf $$ range without the headaches.
                :ogre:

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                  #9
                  I'm planning on a NP203 in front of a NVG271 in my Ranger. Considering the kind of power the diesel guys put through it I am not at all worried about the 271 standing up to a sub-500hp engine and a 2:1 reduction.

                  You might want to consider an BW1356 doubler. The case is easy to cut and weld, decently short, you can make the block off plate yourself and you only really wind up paying big bucks for the custom shaft.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by Hyde View Post
                    203/205. If I can source a Ford 203 the doublers are reasonably priced, I would prefer to have 3 speeds though so that's not my first choice. Also Ford 203s aren't falling out of every truck heading to the junkyard anymore.

                    NWF eco box. NWF has a great rep, I'm not big on extra machining due to using NP planets, anyone know what the machining entails and approximate cost to do so? NP planets aren't nearly as common as the Borg Warner stuff in my searching, plus the extra machining, makes it hard to put this as my first choice. The Titan just has a far higher price tag than I'm looking for with this build.
                    These are the two options that I would go with in your situation. I wouldn't worry about having the low range in the crawl box be the same as the low range in the transfer case. There is not enough difference between the 2:1 in the NP205 and the 2.71:1 in the NP planetaries to be worthwhile in my opinion. I have a Behemoth 1350/1354 setup in my Bronco II which gives me 1:1, 2.48:1, and 6.15:1 in double low. Even with "only" two low range ratios, I still have 3 overlapping gears in each range (I have a 5 speed), and I don't ever find myself wishing for something between the 2.48:1 and 6.15:1.

                    My Behemoth box has been great, and my experience, as well as a buddy of mine who also bought a doubler from them, were not a complete nightmare like a lot of the stories you hear about. That said it did take us both a month or two to get our parts, but I bought mine about 6 years ago or more, and he bought his about three years ago I think, so things very well could be worse now. The nice thing about Behemoth as you pointed out is that you can just use a 31 spline Ford planetary and not have to screw around adapting a 31 spline input like you have to with a NWF box. Aside from that issue though, with the NWF box only being modestly more expensive and their great reputation, my next doubler will be a NWF unit. If you do go that route, I would be really interested in seeing what it takes to get one behind a Ford NP435.

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                      #11
                      Originally posted by arse_sidewards View Post
                      You might want to consider an BW1356 doubler. The case is easy to cut and weld, decently short, you can make the block off plate yourself and you only really wind up paying big bucks for the custom shaft.
                      The standard 1356 case is magnesium, so pretty much a no go on the welding front. He would need to find a BW1356 with PTO, those have aluminum cases.
                      88 Ford F-turd50 IDI Crawler

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                        #12
                        Originally posted by Toreadorranger View Post

                        The standard 1356 case is magnesium, so pretty much a no go on the welding front. He would need to find a BW1356 with PTO, those have aluminum cases.
                        Also, the full-size chain drive cases don't fit the greatest between RBV frame rails. I have a 1356 in my beater Bronco II, and while the 2.69:1 low range is nice compared to the NP205 low range, I wouldn't hack up my frame to put one in if I already had a 205.

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by '84 Bronco II View Post

                          Also, the full-size chain drive cases don't fit the greatest between RBV frame rails. I have a 1356 in my beater Bronco II, and while the 2.69:1 low range is nice compared to the NP205 low range, I wouldn't hack up my frame to put one in if I already had a 205.
                          I think the reference was more to using the 1356 as a crawlbox in front of the NP205, not to run it as the rear case.
                          88 Ford F-turd50 IDI Crawler

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                            #14
                            Originally posted by Toreadorranger View Post

                            The standard 1356 case is magnesium, so pretty much a no go on the welding front. He would need to find a BW1356 with PTO, those have aluminum cases.
                            It's an aluminum magnesium alloy. Get it stupid clean, preheat and stitch it together one fat tack at a time with these.

                            https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Demon-ER.../dp/B00I4WXWD8

                            Or braze it.

                            Originally posted by Toreadorranger View Post

                            I think the reference was more to using the 1356 as a crawlbox in front of the NP205, not to run it as the rear case.
                            Exactly. Hence why you'd need to weld it.
                            Last edited by arse_sidewards; 06-16-2020, 09:10 AM.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by arse_sidewards View Post

                              It's an aluminum magnesium alloy. Get it stupid clean, preheat and stitch it together one fat tack at a time with these.

                              https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Demon-ER.../dp/B00I4WXWD8

                              Or braze it.



                              Exactly. Hence why you'd need to weld it.
                              hmm, that's good to know, I just assumed it was a no go. That would be a viable option for a crawl box then. They are dirt cheap. I can't give away the one I pulled from my F-250. Manual shift slip yoke 1356s would make a great donor for this.
                              88 Ford F-turd50 IDI Crawler

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